Curse

CHunterX · Oct 23, 2007, 10:33 AM // 10:33

I posted this in the middle of the large thread regarding making more (grind) titles account based, and thought it deserved its own thread (it is a suggestion), since I was one of the few who offered a reasonable suggestion in the entire thread other than, "make them all account based without requirements," and, "leave them alone." I also expanded on the description. One final note, at least one character will still have to grind these titles to max, I'm not suggesting they give them away to any and all new/old players.

Make the following titles account based:

Drunkard
Treasure Hunter
Wisdom
Sweet Tooth
Sunspear
Lightbringer
Asura
Deldrimor
Ebon Vanguard
Norn

The following titles will have no limitation on at any level and within any progress of a(n) campaign/expansion that each character will have access to:

Drunkard
Treasure Hunter
Wisdom
Sweet Tooth

For the remaining titles, (Sunspear, Lightbringer, Asura, Deldrimor, Ebon Vanguard, Norn) you have restricted access to them until you perform certain tasks involving character level and storyline advancement per-character.

Here is an example of the character level requirement restriction, regarding an account having Rank 10 in Sunspear:
Level 1-5: Sunspear Master Sergeant (2)
Level 6-10: First Spear (4)
Level 11-15: Sunspear Commander (6)
Level 16-19: Sunspear Castellan (8)
Level 20: Legendary Spearmarshal (10)

The storyline advancement requirement is a little more in-depth that the level requirement per character. The Sunspear Title is already linked to quest progression via the requirements to continue the story line. What I am suggesting for the other titles is something similar: giving access to a Title that has already been raised up on the account via quest completion per character. This will help keep the "lore" to the storyline; because as we can probably all agree on, a character who has never met the Norn should not instantly have Slayer of All (10) before they even visit Eye of the North, but a player who has already earned Slayer of All by repeating multiple quests multiple times shouldn't have to do this across 7 possible characters.

Here is an example of a storyline advancement requirement, regarding an account having Rank 10 in Asuran:
The Knowledgeable Asura: Not Too Dopey (2)
(Two of) Lab Space, Finding Gadd, and/or A Little Help: Not Too Boring (4)
Finding the Bloodstone and The Elusive Golemancer: Not Too Grumpy (6)
Genius Operated Living Enchanted Manifestation: Not Too Lazy (8)
A Time for Heroes (Completing the campaign/expansion): Not Too Shabby (10)

I find that requiring some sort of limitation to accessing the PvE Titles will quell some of the arguments opposing the expansion of Account-based titles, since it doesn't allow Level 1 characters to run around as a Holy Lightbringer (not that it mattered who has what title, but for the sake of argument). These Titles do not necessarily show skill, but mostly time/gold spent, which Guild Wars was advertised not to reward. I just want simpler access to bonuses these Titles offer across an account, when one of my characters has already earned/grind(ground?)/paid for them. And before stating an argument against this, remember, this isn't an argument on how many characters you should be playing. Players were given 8 slots, with options to buy more, what they do with them is their choice, players with only 1 PvE character are obviously not going to support this anyway, though. Also remember, you will still have to acquire these titles by completing quests, vanquishing zones, and turning in books.

Update: It has been suggested that maxing these titles will be "too easy" now that you have 2-8 characters contributing towards the title. I now offer another suggestion to counter this:
Make the Sunspear, Lightbringer, Asura, Deldrimor, Ebon Vanguard, and Norn titles scale to how many PvE characters you have. Heres some examples:
2 PvE characters: 1x higher cap (the same as the titles are now)
4 PvE characters: 1.5x higher cap
6 PvE characters: 2x higher cap
8 PvE characters: 2.5x higher cap
I don't want to encourage Areanet to make these Titles more of a grind than they already are, so I kept the multiples low. But if I had my 8 characters contributing towards these Titles, I personally wouldn't mind higher caps on them. The other 4 titles already have ridiculously high requirements to max, so I left them out. This would also reduce the "time lost" for players who had already maxed titles on more than one or two characters.

NOTE: I wouldn't have a problem with any of these titles if they didn't have drastic effects on PvE skills and lockpicks. This isn't about unlocking Armor crafters. The fact that I am forced to grind for hours on end to have each of my 8 characters be the best possible is the reason I quit FFXI, and I never expected it from Guild Wars. When I first started Prophecies with my Warrior, Monk, Elementalist, and Necromancer, I expected once I hit max level, bought my 1.5k armor, and got a collectors weapon for my characters, everything past that would be purely vanity alone, and my characters would be based on my skill, not the hours I am able to dedicate to repeating my actions hundredfold.

And I ask mods to not close/combine this with the "Make all grind-based titles account based" thread. These are two different suggestions to the same problem.

BlackSephir · Oct 23, 2007, 11:18 AM // 11:18

I like it, makes sense and shows big "GTFO" to people who say that lvl 5 warrior with holy lightbringer doesn't make sense and yet lvl 5 warrior savior of the Kurzicks makes sense

So... /signed

Matt_Night · Oct 23, 2007, 11:26 AM // 11:26

/signed

definitelly for the Treasure Hunter & Wisdom titles - would save me at least some reloggig just to ID gold loots...

DeXyre · Oct 23, 2007, 11:45 AM // 11:45

/signed
nice idea linking them to quests/lvls

MirkoTeran · Oct 23, 2007, 11:50 AM // 11:50

/unsigned... stop making game easier as it already is.

Star Gazer · Oct 23, 2007, 12:01 PM // 12:01

making the game easier? lol wut?

anyway, /signed

vergerefosh · Oct 23, 2007, 12:03 PM // 12:03

Mirko what he's suggesting doesn't necessarily make it easier. Ok, so people don't have to grind to R whatever Asura/Dwarf/Norn etc, that's a good thing. The idea he has for implementing it is good and balanced

And then the titles he has suggested not putting any limits on also make sense. Having wisdom and treasure hunter as single character only never made any sense to me when it affects salvage chance. It leaves the option of either id'ing, chest opening and salvaging on only one character, and getting a lot better, or just spreading it out as you play and having reduced chances of successful chest openings. I know I'd rather ALL of my characters had a good chance, as with the things combined, rather than the reduced chances I have currently available.

The title system as it is does seem to penalise those who chose to make and work on multiple characters, despite the fact that we're encouraged to do so by getting character slots with the campaigns and the ability to buy char slots. This is a fair way to provide access to the titles to everyone, and a more beneficial way to level them up

arcanemacabre · Oct 23, 2007, 12:04 PM // 12:04

Fine with me.

/signed to this more detailed idea

Nice work, CHunterX

CHunterX · Oct 23, 2007, 12:04 PM // 12:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by MirkoTeran

/unsigned... stop making game easier as it already is.

Not necessarily easier, just less consumed with repeating grind.
EDIT: Redirected quote.

Explodie · Oct 23, 2007, 12:09 PM // 12:09

/not signed

Gaile said that titles was in the game, because people "ASKED" it, and now, everyone wants to make it easier.
Guildwars was made to play campaign, then leave the game, wait until next campaign, come back game.
But people whined they want more in the game, so Anet gave it to them, and now, there are whines all over again.

So make a choice, and not first the one thing and then the other thing. Why do you think there werent any titles in the first game?

My opinion is, let the titles stay, or remove them completely!
But stop whining wth "I want not do anything for a title"

>.<

Tatum · Oct 23, 2007, 12:13 PM // 12:13

/signed
probably, it will make game much easier, but like the idea.

CHunterX · Oct 23, 2007, 12:20 PM // 12:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tatum

/signed
probably, it will make game much easier, but like the idea.

I tried to improve on the "much easier" argument with an update in the original post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Explodie

But stop whining wth "I want not do anything for a title"

Did you even read the original post?

BlackSephir · Oct 23, 2007, 12:31 PM // 12:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Explodie

/not signed

Gaile said that titles was in the game, because people "ASKED" it, and now, everyone wants to make it easier.

Replace "easier" with "less grindy and boring" and you might be on something there.

Explodie · Oct 23, 2007, 12:40 PM // 12:40

YEah i read the original and that was even worse than this one

But stil, delete all titles or keep them as they are now =/

Then dont do titles? No-one force you to get the titles you know, its what the people want, if Anet modify titles NOW, you will get alot of fight, then 1/2 of the people leave GuildWars for good.
Because they have like 2/3/4 character with all the grind titles, and they need money slinks and grind titles are money slinks xD

Like:
Drunkard
Treasure Hunter
Wisdom
Sweet Tooth

These titles are the biggest money slinks ingame, so why would Anet make them Account bassed? The more of them you want on different charater, how less money you have.

Lightbringer/Sunspears etc aren't that hard to get ... (and yes i know what i'm saying)

And personaly i like grinding <33 (yes i have a life and i play 1 à 2 hours a day)

gremlin · Oct 23, 2007, 12:42 PM // 12:42

Very good compromise to the either or squabble presently going on elsewhere.

Signed in triplicate

Onarik Amrak · Oct 23, 2007, 12:42 PM // 12:42

# Drunkard
# Treasure Hunter
# Wisdom
# Sweet Tooth

Agreed for those. The others not so sure. /signed

CHunterX · Oct 23, 2007, 12:50 PM // 12:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Explodie

Then dont do titles? No-one force you to get the titles you know

No one forces you to do the extra-attribute quests either, but if you don't, your character is weaker than everyone else that has done them, regardless of your playing skill. There is little difference in having a max PvE title and doing the attribute quests, besides the massive amount of time the former takes. Without them, your character will be weaker than everyone else, regardless of your playing skill. When it comes down to it, if you had two players equally skilled at playing a Mesmer, both had all skills unlocked, but one had Rank 5 and the other Rank 10 in Asuran, and you required Pain Inverter, you are going to chose the latter simply because they grind more, not that they are better. Is it the Rank 5's fault that they can't dedicate a hours to max these titles by doing repetitive actions?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Explodie

if Anet modify titles NOW, you will get alot of fight, then 1/2 of the people leave GuildWars for good. Because they have like 2/3/4 character with all the grind titles, and they need money slinks and grind titles are money slinks xD

With the updated original post, you'd see that having 2/3/4/8 characters with the grind titles would have their points combined, and a new cap for the Titles. Virtually no one outside of the players who have maxed Drunkard and Sweet-tooth on two characters will be losing any time spent, besides possibly the odd number'd players (3,5,7), since the cap raises only every 2 PvE characters. Again, I must suggest you read the original post again

Quote:

Originally Posted by Explodie

And personaly i like grinding <33 (yes i have a life and i play 1 à 2 hours a day)

Guild Wars wasn't advertised as a grind game. If you like grinding for max stats, there was much better games to chose from, but now that Areanet has flip-flopped on their view of the game, I can't say that is true anymore.

wu is me · Oct 23, 2007, 12:52 PM // 12:52

In response to this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHunterX

Update: It has been suggested that maxing these titles will be "too easy" now that you have 2-8 characters contributing towards the title. I now offer another suggestion to counter this:
Make the Sunspear, Lightbringer, Asura, Deldrimor, Ebon Vanguard, and Norn titles scale to how many PvE characters you have. Heres some examples:
2 PvE characters: 1x higher cap (the same as the titles are now)
4 PvE characters: 1.5x higher cap
6 PvE characters: 2x higher cap
8 PvE characters: 2.5x higher cap
I don't want to encourage Areanet to make these Titles more of a grind than they already are, so I kept the multiples low. But if I had my 8 characters contributing towards these Titles, I personally wouldn't mind higher caps on them. The other 4 titles already have ridiculously high requirements to max, so I left them out.

I post my idea from the "other" thread

Quote:

Originally Posted by wu is me

However people found it to be a problem that the titles would have less meaning if they current ranks were maintained. In other words people believed ranks would need to be more difficult to progress, if the titles were made account based.

This however will present a problem for people who only want to play one character, as they will have to bear more grind for equal reward.

My suggestion is that there be a way, say.. an npc, where you can choose how the points towards the titles are allocated. Under this system, the ranks reqs for all titles will be multiplied by some number, say.. four. You may then choose to recieve 4x points towards the title on the one character, or across all characters. The actual multiplier used will depend on how much anet wants to promote character "promiscuity"

.

which also got ignored and merged due to unoriginality =P

CHunterX · Oct 23, 2007, 12:59 PM // 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by wu is me

which also got ignored and merged due to unoriginality =P

Which is why I would suggest my thread not get merged, and instead, the other thread closed. The other thread is out of control as it is, suggestions are becoming lost and ignored in the pages of the flames going back and forth between a few, myself included. People who have honest suggestions like you and I should be able to express them outside of a 14-page flamefest. I'm not saying that I've been warned my thread would become merged, but I could see a mod quickly skimming this thread and tossing it into the other thread.

Cargan · Oct 23, 2007, 01:02 PM // 13:02

/signed.

I really don't like getting a gold drop and not being able to ID it for missing another ID for the wisdom title. likewise, I don't like seeing the treasure hunter title only being applicable to one character.

note: Wisdom title is not a gold sink as you can't buy golds from traders. it only moves money between players, not sinking it.

having the treasure hunter title account based would most likely sink more gold in lockpicks for the casual player as people would be more inclined to buy them for any character they are playing and not just the one. I know when I'm playing any character other than my main I think twice before buying a lockpick.

I agree that confining titles to one character is passively forcing people to play just one or two characters instead of enjoying all professions to their fullest.

I would also support the option of an endgame NPC for each campaign to be able to purchase the knowledge (max titles) of another one of your characters, ie. making max titles an unlock of the title at the NPC. paying an endgame NPC 5k to be able to view a map (max cartography title) for example makes sense. In the same style, an elite skills NPC upon completing the skill hunter title could sell elite skills for 5k to your other characters.

anyways, I'm going offtopic. yeah, account based titles. I want